If You’re Not a Liberal …
So, it continues… Again, I normally NEVER BLOG another person’s site, but again, it was forced upon me. The response is from a fellow sophisticate. Other than his ridiculous name, JediPii, there is little to criticize about this man, or his writing. I have posted his response to my cousin’s BLOG. I though it clearly worthy of “front page news”, and there was no need to bury it in the editorial section (comments section). Please enjoy…
Posted 7/17/2006 at 8:30 PM by JediPii
Josh, it’s hubris to think that you could understand America and it’s people after so brief a period of time. I’ve read what you’ve written, and it’s pretty clear that you’ve barely scratched the surface. I don’t blame you for that… There’s a lot going on here. But I do hold you accountable for your dismal self-assessment, thinking you’ve got us figured out. The truth of the matter is that the more a man learns, the more he realizes that there is so much more to learn. Yours is the mistake that all young people make.
I take particular issue with a number of the criticisms you have levied…
Perhaps the most egregious is on the topic of racism. I will refer you to Wikipedia to compare the ethnic makeup of Canada, and that of the United States.
As you browse through those two pages, I want you to pay keen attention to something. On the Canada page, they go to great lengths to differentiate between English, and French, and Scots, and Irish, and Welsh, and Norwegian, etc.
On the United States page, once you get past the initial statistics, you’ll come across this statements:
The Census Bureau’s definition of “white” is not necessarily the definition most widely held by Americans in general. Most Americans define “white” to exclude all Hispanics, even those of exclusive or predominantly European descent. Using that definition, the white proportion of the U.S. population is currently at 67.4%.
Of the people in the US, 1 in 3 is a visible minority, or of non-White descent. In Canada, it’s 1 in 10. My point is this: how on Earth can you possibly have anything to say about the status of racial relations in the United States?
Of course Canada can embrace multiculturalism, and have a healthy respect for it’s minority population… It barely has one. 90% of the population is made up of White Europeans. Minorities in Canada are, for the most part, a curiosity, not a community.
The US has a long, ugly history with racism. It’s an embarrassing blemish on an otherwise remarkable story, and it continues to a degree even today. Much less so today that at any other point in our history, and improving all the time, but there it is. That said, a non-white immigrant to the US today has a better chance of improving his economic lot in life here than anywhere else on the planet. A family can go from abject poverty to affluence in a single generation. It happens all the time.
The shame is that stories like that aren’t newsworthy. It’s much easier to advance a political agenda on the backs of societal failure than it is on it’s success stories.
The bottom line is that you’re looking at a problem without also examining the historical context that surrounds it. If I were to go back to your original post, and address each of these issues in turn, it would be the same story. This, unfortunately, stems from a worldview largely derived from the warm busom of institutionalized higher learning, and less from experience out here in the cold hard reality.
Conservatives aren’t opposed to welfare because they hate the less fortunate… They are opposed to welfare because it prevents the less fortunate from developing the tools and skills they need to be successful without assistance.
Conservatives aren’t opposed to affirmative action because it gives minorities a leg up… They are opposed to affirmative action because in many cases, it prevents the best qualified applicant from being given a job. (It also diminishes the accomplishments made by minorities without the benefit of preferential hiring.)
Conservatives don’t want the minimum wage raised because they understand that minimum wage jobs aren’t meant to support a family. They are entry level jobs meant as a springboard into the workforce. Raising the minimum wage results in fewer entry level jobs available to unskilled/untrained people entering the workforce.
Get out in the world. Earn your own way. Provide for yourself for a while without anyone’s assistance. You’ll be amazed at how your perspective will change, having stood on your own two feet. You may even see the wisdom of Winston Churchill’s statement:
“If you’re not a liberal when you’re twenty, you have no heart. If you’re not a conservative by the time you are thirty, you have no brain.”
July 17th, 2006 at 11:53 pm
Nice Work People! Your mothers would be proud that you voiced your opinion I’m sure.
Good to see I got some blood boiling over this issue. Some of you have the intent of just proving me wrong, others taking a neutral stance and others perhaps are just out to make sure I don’t get away with this one. Alrighty than.
I’m blown away on how many people I got involved in this heated debate. Wow! So many opinions and they’re quite good too, unfortunately some are personal which is unfortunate.
Okay, first of all I had no intention of insulting anyone. I was simply stating my opinion on what I said in my blog: what “I had seen and heard.” Maybe I’ve just been hanging out with too many Liberals, not that I’d call myself one at all. Secondly, I don’t believe I have made necessarily biased claims. Like Erica said, I was simply voicing what I had seen and heard… doesn’t mean my opinion is right but it doesn’t mean that yours is either. I will admit I was pretty upfront on some issues particularly sensitive ones such as racism. Canada has its share, no question there. I simply have just noticed since I’ve been down here that groups tend to be exclusionary towards one another. And fair enough. There’s a lot more going on down here - much larger minority groups with greater influence. And Pii you’re absolutely correct, Canada does have a much lower minority group population. Looks like you’ve been keeping up with your northern neighbor’s domestic affairs…good on ya mate! What started me on this issue of racism, which seems to be the most heated topic in this debate was an article I had read on English R & B artist Craig David. Now, he is Black..or African English and he happens to have a white or caucasian guitar player. They travelled throughout Europe without a problem but when they arrived in American it became a big issue that he had a white guitarist. It was big news apparently. Crazy right. Well it actually came to the point where they were not welcome in several venues because of this. I don’t think this would happen anywhere else in the western world except the United States and there is good reason for this. The US had slaves til the late 19th century while the rest of the western world had almost completely emanipated by then. It was not until the late 50s, I believe, that African Americans and other races got full civil rights. That’s only 50 yrs ago!! Of course there is still going to be great division among races. I could go on on but the issue but that could take a few pages. However, the US has made great strides and is progressively becoming a much more excepting and multicultural nation.
Now I will agree (not that i ever disagreed) that there are substantial rights for all who live and work here and this is great. However, I still think many of the agencies in the US are too powerful…but perhaps that’s how they need to be in this nation that has run wild with immigrants from all around the world. Just not my cup of tea though. Canada has virtually no intelligence..agencies and I greatly appreciate this as a Canadian citizen. I don’t know about you but I don’t want the possibility of cameras in my house and agents in my backyard watching me. This does happen does it not? Please prove me wrong.
Okay, onto medical care. My Aunt Marianne is a nurse in the Greater Vancouver area and she responded to my comments on health care. Unfortunately she seemed to have taken the my blog and this issue quite personally. First of all, I had no intention of coming across like I was praising the Canadian Health Care System. I’ll admit it’s a complete mess…like I said. I just believe that a system where the government makes health care payments mandatory is better than having you pay enormous fees. Like c’mon who wants to pay $700 a month for health insurance for their family? That’s why so many lower class here have to resort to welfare…they simply cannot afford to pay both. What if their child is shot? (something us spoiled Canadians don’t have to worry about) How will they pay for that? They’d be better off letting them die because the rest of their family would suffer tremendously because of the costs for medical. That’s backwards if you ask me.
Okay short one of education. I simply meant Public school systems in the US and not University’s. Thanks for the list though Dallas, you guys definitely are more impressive that Canada in that department. Goes to show how poor your k-12 system is though with such a large percentage of immigrants graduating in relation to born Americans.
Ya so, I don’t how this all turned into a Liberal vs. Conservative topic on top of everything else, but like I said I wouldn’t call myself neither. I am only 24 and I am changing all the time. I hope to God though I will never become a full blown conservative. There’s nothing wrong with taking the middle path all your life is there (in politics of course)? Should keep me from becoming biased.
JA. So once again I appreciate all the comments and feel free to write more reflections on my comments; but please go easy on insults.
Josh
July 18th, 2006 at 11:12 am
Now that I am a little more rested just a few more things.
First of all Jedi Grand Master Pii, if you’re so talented in the ways of the force try this one on for size, since this seems to be a battle between views.
Answer me these 5 questions…Canada or US
VIOLENCE and SAFETY - Which country is safer to live in and which has lower violence per capita?
EDUCATION - Where is k-12 education a much more serious problem?
RACISM - where is it most prevalent and a leading social problem in the Western World?
GOVERNMENT - Which government can take your life away at the snap of a finger?…I won’t mention the agencies I wouldn’t want to offend anyone.
HEALTH CARE - Clearly this is a close one. But Pii how bout you go to people who don’t make big numbers like yourself and ask them what they’d prefer and why. I guarantee you the majority would prefer state covered medical care because any other option is unfeasible. So onto my question. Which country has better health care? If you could pick one which style would you pick?
So maybe with these entries all you conservatives have a better idea of where I’m coming from? I’m not trying to be offensive or biased I’m just observing the raw facts. And Pii I do live on my own and I very much appreciate having the government take care of my health care. I would be in massive debt had they not covered my dental work, my physio, my chiropractor, my checkups, portions of my medical prescriptions. Man, I would be afraid to be a student here and have to pay tens of thousands for education and then health care on top of that. In Canada I pay a small fraction of what students pay and I live in a much cleaner and safer environment where education standards are just as high.. (whatever your stats say Dallas). Where do you think all the brilliant minds in the US come from. Look at my cousin Dallas. He was educated in Canada and the government paid for his education!!! Doubt they’d do that here. He was looking for money and so he came down here and found riches. Good on him. No doubt there is good money here… you win there and.. you can have it. I just take value in lifestyle and standard of living first over money. And I may not be married like some of you but I know damn well I wouldn’t want to raise my kids in some place where they have a considerable chance of being a victim of physical or sexual abuse.
Look at someone who is a below average income earner in Canada. I bet you that they live better than most middle class people here. Ha and they only have to work 40 hrs a week instead of 50-60. Oh and yes Marianne I have read your comments. I hope you took a glance at mine. I very much appreciate the ESL programs that we have in Canada. Giving these people a chance to blend in isn’t a problem with me. And those who haven’t… well their kids are. I have several friends of different colors…even Arabian. Look at my Grandpa Abe. Sweetest guy I know. He’s right out of Iran. I think people should discriminate attitudes and not people… even the individual because that hate just breeds in us into something ugly.
Alright I settle my case. Conservatives…shoot! I think I’m getting a better “understanding” now, sorry for the mix up. (I guess I don’t understand you guys)
take care, ya’ll be safe
July 18th, 2006 at 11:11 pm
Josh, my knowledge of the force is truly dizzying, but I really don’t need it.
I’m sure we could go down a long list of UN sanctioned measures, and Canada would fair far better than the United States. As a matter of fact, I am fairly certain that the UN holds Canada up as the poster child for what a nation should look like, and how it should be administered. You have a lower infant mortality rate, and a higher life expecancy, and all manner of superior “indicators.”
Violent crime per capita: Canada wins.
Education: While more accessible in Canada, I think the US wins this one in terms of quality.
Racism: I think I already addressed this - Show me another Western nation that approaches the ethnic makeup of the United States, and I’ll show you a nation with racial tension.
Government: Less obtrusive? I think Canada gets the edge in some respects, but falls miserably short in others.
Health Care: You actually ask two different questions here:
Which country has better health care: The United States, without question.
If you could pick which style, which would I pick: The private health care model, again, without question.
Oh, and before I forget to mention it, I’m not a “conservative” or a “republican.” I’m far scarier… I’m a Libertarian. My politcal viewpoints are further right on economic issues than conservatives dare to tread, and further left on social and privacy issues than liberals dare to dream, and yet, there is no contradiction. Spend some time reading about Libertarianism if you really want a picture of what you’re up against in me…
You are greatful that your government takes care of your health care… You realize, of course, that it isn’t your government that’s picking up the tab, right? It’s your fellow citizens, your co-workers, and your friends. Your government merely collects the funds (without asking), squanders some of it in the name of “administration,” and allocates those funds as necessary.
Do you, as a “free man,” have the option of not participating in this system? Can you say, “Hey Government, I’ll keep my portion and provide for my own health care?” Of course not. Socialized medicine cannot offer that kind of flexibility, lest the system completely collapse.
Your Aunt (I believe it was your Aunt) points out how many people abuse the system, and that’s from someone on the front line. Guess who picks up the tab for that? You do.
Health insurance can be quite expensive in the US. No doubt about it. But I have options. I can negotiate with a number of different insurance carriers. My company can engage in collective bargaining with competing providers. Me? I’m relatively healthy. I’m rarely sick. When I am, I don’t use the hostpital emergency room as my primary care physician. Why shouldn’t I be able to pay a little more to ensure exceptional care when I need it? Conversely, why shouldn’t I be able to pay a little less because of a demonstrated history of not abusing the system?
And you also commented to the effect that an uninsured shooting victim would not be treated… That’s patently absurd. Every lifesaving measure possible would be utilized to ensure the patient’s survival, insured or not. Now it’s true that they would be able to stay at John’s Hopkins for the duration of their recovery. Once stable, they’d probably be transferred to County General, but that’s a far cry from not being treated.
As for education… Did you actually try to imply that Dallas is a capable, productive member of society as a result of his State Sponsored education? If I was going for the throat, I’d say that he is successful in spite of it. The fact of the matter is that Dallas would be successful in life regardless of whether he went to college or not. He’s a smart guy with an engaging personality. In a meritocracy like the United States, that’ll take you a long way.
Does it surprise you to learn that I never went to college? Would you have guessed from having spoken to me, or from the way I write? Public education (and I played a lot of hookie, believe it), and not even some anomolous “great” public school… Very average. I was fortunate to have been born with a good head on my shoulders, but believe it when I say that the rest has been the product of hard work, and dedication.
In the United States, I can get away with not having a college degree. There are a lot of people without them, and it’s a society geared toward rewarding performance. In Canada, where virtually anyone can go to college (can afford to go), would I have been able to get my foot in the door in a professional field, or would I have been dismissed out of hand, disqualified because I had no degree? I honestly don’t know the answer, but my suspicion is that I’d have had a harder time.
Lifestyle and standard of living over money? Without money, you’d have a pretty poor lifestyle, and a terrible standard of living, even in Canada. It’s true, we are a nation of workaholics, but that is as much a matter of choice as anything else. I could work 40 hours a week, and nobody would complain. I choose to work more than that, because it affords me additional opportunities, and it ensures that my family will have additional opportunities. Work hard, play hard.
Considerable chance of children being a victim of physical or sexual abuse? Will your children not live at home, because most child abuse occurs within the home, at the hands of immediate or extended family. That could happen anywhere…
I’m not going to pursue this any further. I’m not trying to beat you down, or change your mind, nor do I view this discussion as a competition. I merely wanted to plant the seed in your mind that perhaps you’d been a little hasty in formulating some of your opinions, and point out that any conclusions you may have drawn that don’t account for the history and context of an issue come off as ill-informed at best, and you seem smarter than that.
Now throw away that Che Geuvera t-shirt, and cut that hair!